生物与医学2022science.org
人类热量限制揭示健康寿命的免疫代谢调节因子
Caloric restriction in humans reveals immunometabolic regulators of health span
专业 · 约 55 分钟读完前置知识：免疫学基础、代谢生理学、人体临床试验设计
导读
这篇发表在 Science 上的研究利用人类热量限制试验（CALERIE）的样本，分析长期减少约四分之一热量摄入对人体免疫与代谢系统的影响，并从中找出与健康寿命相关的免疫代谢调节因子（如 PLA2G7）。研究思路是把人体干预数据与后续机制验证结合起来，试图解释热量限制带来的健康益处背后的分子通路。
HN 关注点：“少吃能否延寿”这一话题的可操作性与代价：热量限制或间歇性禁食是否真有效、会不会以肌肉流失和虚弱为代价，以及普通人能否长期坚持。
HN 评论精选
这几条评论里：质疑 2 亲历 2
亲历亲历间歇性禁食后发现进食需求随活动量变化，“一日三餐”更多是习惯而非生理需要。
我不是专家，只能谈个人经验和身边人的观察。最近开始尝试间歇性禁食，最有意思的一点是发现自己身体的需求会随体力活动水平变化：不运动的日子里，身体需要的“燃料”少得惊人。在发达国家，我们从小被培养成一天三餐、日复一日，几乎不考虑身体是否真的需要。事实上我们被训练成一天饿三次，不管是否真的需要进食。我还注意到很多人（包括我自己）会强迫性地吃，或者纯粹因为无聊而吃。
ciconia查看英文原文
IANAE, can only talk from personal experience and observing the people around me. Having started practicing intermittent fasting recently, one of the most interesting aspects of the experience is to see how my body's needs change according to my level of physical activity. On days when I'm not physically active, it's quite astonishing how little fuel my body needs. We're all (in developed countries at least) raised on having three meals a day, day in day out, without much consideration for whether our body needs it. In fact, we're conditioned to feel hungry three times a day, regardless of whether we really need to eat. I've also noticed how many people (myself included) would eat compulsively, or out of sheer boredom.
质疑质疑：摘要未提肌肉量影响，肌少症—跌倒—失能的链条可能抵消热量限制的益处。
我看不到全文，但摘要里没有提到热量限制方案对人类受试者肌肉量的影响。这正是我怀疑它能否真正延长人类寿命的原因。我们知道肌少症会增加老年人严重跌倒的风险，而任何医生都能告诉你，一次严重跌倒常常导致行动能力丧失，并引发一连串身体衰退，几年内致死。所以个人而言，我会继续大量摄入热量并坚持高强度运动。也许我老得更快，但至少不会虚弱。
nradov查看英文原文
I can't read the full article, but the abstract didn't mention anything about the effects of the caloric restriction protocol on the muscle mass of human subjects. This is why I'm very skeptical that it will actually work to extend human lifespans. We know that sarcopenia increases the risk of serious falls for elderly people. And any physician can tell you how a bad fall frequently causes loss of mobility, and sets off a chain of physical declines leading to death in a couple years. So personally I'm going to contine eating a lot of calories, and doing a lot of hard exercise. Maybe I'll age faster but at least I won't be frail.
质疑认为热量限制难以推广，并指出蛋白质糖基化/甘氨酸不足等更易着手的抗衰老方向。
确实，如果你“饿”细胞，也会饿到癌细胞之类的东西。祝你能让现代社会里超过个位数百分比的人真正做到热量限制。不过在“健康与长寿”这棵树上还有更低垂的果实：可以去了解蛋白质糖基化（糖附着在蛋白质上）与衰老和慢性炎症的关系。多数动物蛋白中的甘氨酸含量不足。不知道推荐哪个来源，相关文献有成千上万，可以先从这个科普解读入手，感兴趣再用 Google Scholar 深挖。
ck2查看英文原文
Well yes, if you "starve" cells, you also starve things like cancerous cells. Good luck getting modern society to "calorie restrict" beyond single digit percentage of population. But there are even lower hanging fruit on the "health and longevity" tree. Go read about protein glycosylation (where sugar attached to proteins) vs aging and chronic inflammation. Most animal proteins do not have (enough) glycine in them. Dunno which source to link on this as there are thousands but maybe start here as a more layperson explainer and check google scholar for more if interested https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/05/150526085138.htm
亲历两年间歇性禁食加 OMAD 的亲历：体重与 BMI 控制良好，主要挑战是无聊性进食。
我实践间歇性禁食近两年，每天进食窗口 2–6 小时，多数时间每天禁食约 20 小时。最近一个月改成一天一餐（OMAD），只和家人吃晚饭，且只吃自制低碳餐。50 多岁的我体重控制住了，BMI 现在 22.3。饥饿或精力不足不是问题，问题是有时出于“无聊”想吃东西打发时间，但我不想打破惯例，所以能忍住不吃零食。禁食期间我总有一种“宁静”的状态。
NorSoulx查看英文原文
I've been practicing intermittent fasting for close to 2 years, with a 2-6 hour eating window each day. Most of the time the fasting period has been around 20 hours a day. For a month now I've switched to one meal a day (OMAD), only eating dinner with the family. I only eat home made low carb meals. Being 50+ I've been able to keep the weight in check, BMI now 22.3. Hunger or lack of energy is not a problem, it's more the I sometimes out of "boredom" want to eat to pass time. But since I do not want to break the routine, it keeps me from snacking. I always feel a state of "serenity" during the fasting periods.
历次讨论
- 2022Hacker News 讨论帖159 分 · 59 评
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